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2007年白沙东象棋团体赛对局记录:
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(引用 几度:还有第一场大棋盘莫文耀对卢国龙,有谁有记录?我尝试摆出来,但次序记不清了。当时感觉莫文耀前半盘占优,但中局有一步可能走错了,丢子...)我只记的前半部.......请几度讲评.....[陶菲克 (11-21 9:04, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]61楼

(引用 几度:车9平3,红可以炮八进四或把三路马跳出来踩中卒,黑也不好走。主要是将来不得不走士4进5,则将门被红车控制。)the next time when we meet at SIXGA, may be 几度 has times to teach me ..from Move 4 (I will use 车9平3 instead of 炮2平3) and 马2进3 or 马2进4 later if I have a chance.

Just to share a secret, I know who is 陈中和, and I know all these young players are very good, so before 车9平 8 in Move 3, I decided to change to 车9进1, since then I purposely used some new moves and it was very effective (of course only for this game) and he used more than 30 minutes for the first 10 Moves. Actually, for this game, I should leave it with a draw at Move 12.

Next time must have some practices before trying new move .....
[棋人生 (11-21 10:56, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]62楼

(引用 卷心菜:多啦A梦,有时我遇到炮可以吃子(或兑子)时,总有要去“炮打”的冲动。冲动是魔鬼,请多啦A梦从布袋中拿出道具帮帮忙。)一时的冲动往往要付出惨痛的代价的....下棋时,冲动也算是一大忌..都要尽量克制自己的情绪.
冷静的分析,才能把局面审得正确....你在赛场有注意
到吗...那些话少的一般都蛮冷静的..话多又喜欢自言
自语的多数也蛮冲动的.
[多啦A梦 (11-21 11:58, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]63楼

(引用 一刀n断:我也不弱势求和,我觉得没面子,就因为那个“求”字。。。可是我优势的时候或者觉得局面没意思的时候会试着提和,还相对体面,可是被拒绝...)标准的说法是谋和。一般说残局劣势谋和,待定对局向对方提和,都没有这个求字。谋和,包括了向对方提和以及要求裁判判和。

提和有几种情况。一是优势但时间不够,没有信心赢下来,情愿和棋;二是局面均衡,两难进取,猜想对方也判断发展下去是和棋;三是已经形成或将要形成定式和棋,一般是劣势一方提出;四是优势而不需要胜,例如最近中国全国团体赛和棋黒胜,接受黑方提和就等于比分自杀;五是残局经验不足,在双方还互有机会的情况下急于提和;第六种比较特殊,本身并不一定要和,但提和测试对方是否很想胜,再决定自己的战略。

按棋规规定,双方只能轮流提和,即禁止一方连续提和。这大概是出于避免棋手用这种方法干扰对手的目的。有时的情况,是一方第2次提和(连续提和),对方不介意,接受和棋,裁判也不知道有这个违例的情况存在,不过并没有什么不好的地方。当然,如果是简单的定式和局,可以随时要求裁判判和。

对提和的反应,也有几种情况。一是欣然接受,皆大欢喜;二是觉得局面仍然复杂,不愿和棋;第三种比较过分,即认为自己棋力较高,且有一丝希望能骗倒对方,下风棋也不愿和;第四种是团体赛或个人赛分数的关系,没有和棋的选择。提和时要估计到这些可能,不然如果对方拒绝,造成自己心浮气躁,就不好了。

裁判判和,说起来简单,但其实也是有水分的,例如这些情况:

限着成和。现在亚洲规则规定,50回合不吃子(提和方将军最多算10步),自然限着判和。现在新加坡很多比赛采取包干制,棋手不用记录,50回合怎么算?所以只好在形成不怎么会再吃子的局面后,要求裁判在旁边算步,从第1步算起。当然包干制有时间限制,走到50回合的机会一般认为不高,所以有时是没什么人要算这种东西的。如果是10分钟快棋,当然更没人管。

定式判和。形成和棋定式,裁判有权判和。这里要注意一点,即还没有形成定式时,例如车炮兵仕相全对车马士象全,和棋机会很高,但除非车炮被牵死不能解脱,裁判是不判和的,只能指望对手接受提和。但什么是定式?通常定式是指残局书报上刊出,并公认没有破法的和棋形状。这就有点麻烦。越复杂的残局,存有破法的机会就越高。不过,一般裁判不判和的情况,是认为复杂的残局,防守的一方不容易下出正确的着法,因此采取限着的做法。例如马炮仕相全对单炮士象全,不同裁判的做法可能不一样。即使是在国际大赛上,马兵有仕相对士象全,理论上能和,实际上要求士象全方走得很精确,有时有些特级大师不提和,裁判犹豫了一下也没判和。裁判其实也是处于一个两难的位置。听说,通常中国国内的裁判会比较严。在较低水平的比赛中,判和的就更少了,例如在新加坡的小学生赛中,我也见过车兵对车士象全不立刻判和的,但也只觉得有一点过分而已。这个残局,可能中上水平的小学生才能守和吧。

循环不变。双方都是允许着法(或者长将对长将,长捉对长捉),循环不变,可以判和。问题是如果裁判要判时,一方表示要变,会怎么样?中国大陆的规则,好像是修改后,循环3次,立刻判和。亚洲规则,好像还是可以变着接走的。这一点我自己有些混乱,要问权威,比如王兴南。


[几度 (11-21 12:00, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]64楼

(引用 几度:标准的说法是谋和。一般说残局劣势谋和,待定对局向对方提和,都没有这个求字。谋和,包括了向对方提和以及要求裁判判和。 提和有几种情...)还有一点说了老半天,漏了最重要的一点:劣势提和应该是在自己有信心守和的情况下提出。[几度 (11-21 12:04, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]65楼

(引用 棋人生:the next time when we meet at SIXGA, may be 几度 has times to teach me ..from Move 4 (I will use 车9平3 instead of 炮2平3) and ...)客气了车9平3后,出路不畅,总要亏一些的。如果抱着让对方2-3先的心理,又走得精确的话,可能还可以吧。只是下指导棋没问题,在团体赛这样下相当冒险。要走横车对横车,单提马的布阵比较容易走。要顺炮横车对横车,可能不要急于车9平3,先马2进3或卒7进1较好。黑车有平3、平6以及车1进1后车9平4邀兑的选择。炮2平3再车9平3,我说欺着是开玩笑,不过这两着加在一起,是很大的失误。

[几度 (11-21 12:15, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]66楼

(引用 几度:客气了车9平3后,出路不畅,总要亏一些的。如果抱着让对方2-3先的心理,又走得精确的话,可能还可以吧。只是下指导棋没问题,在团体赛这�...)Yes, 炮2平3 followed by 车9平3, very bad moves, ....
only that his first 11 moves followed my thinkings, definitely not in future games as now all friends at 悟入棋途 know can kill me so easily if I have the above moves... hihi
[棋人生 (11-21 13:09, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]67楼

(引用 陶菲克:上半场我没下, 看了一会儿, 感觉上在红弃子后,黑走软了以致没能拿下....... ...)你记得的也不只前半部分了。不容易啊。后来也就多走了6-7回合,兑去一车,黑多子,但双方愿和。

1. 炮二平五 马8进7 2. 马二进三 车9平8
3. 车一平二 马2进3 4. 兵七进一 卒7进1
5. 车二进六 炮8平9 6. 车二平三 炮9退1
7. 马八进九 车8进6 8. 炮八平七 马3退5
9. 车九平八 车1进2 10. 兵七进一 炮9平7
11. 炮五进四 马7进5 12. 车三平五 炮2平5
13. 兵七进一 车1退2 14. 士六进五 卒7进1
15. 车八进五 马5进7 16. 车五退一 卒7进1
17. 马三退一 车8退3 18. 车五平七 炮7平3
19. 兵七平六 炮3进6 20. 兵六进一 炮3平8
21. 车七平三 马7进5 22. 车三退二 马5进4
23. 车八平六 马4进2 24. 兵六进一 士4进5
25. 兵五进一 车1平2 26. 车三平七 象3进1
27. 马一进二 车8平7 28. 马二退四 炮8平1
29. 相七进九 马2退3 30. 兵五进一

个人所见,卢国龙这盘对红七路兵过河的攻势,解得很好,形成对攻。红14回合或许相七进五稳一些,16回合似乎就不如车五平六。18回合我当时在台下粗看以为可以兵七进一,黑如车8平3,则车五平七,但这着黑有马7进5的着法。因此也许可考虑兵七平六限制黑马7进5,则车8平4,马九进七,之后随时有车五平六,对攻中红方不弱。局中着法,弃子抢先,并吃回过河卒,也是各有千秋。24回合红争胜不愿简化,因此不吃炮,但过后黑方防守功夫深厚,再兑一子,形成多子略优的局面。

[几度 (11-21 14:14, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]68楼

(引用 一刀n断:我也不弱势求和,我觉得没面子,就因为那个“求”字。。。可是我优势的时候或者觉得局面没意思的时候会试着提和,还相对体面,可是被拒绝...)被徐源庆杀得和都和不掉,好惨!能和就不错了,开局就输势,大列炮输好多次了,[棋仙 (11-21 17:55, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]69楼

(引用 卷心菜:祝贺义顺南第一,甘邦格南第二,白沙东第三)May be is reason behind !
Other teams had put more focus on Boonlay ,White sand A/B and ended up 义顺南,甘邦格南 break through.
This can be analysis from 棋人生 posted articles "detailed Results of all 110 Boards".
Don't misunderstand that i am saying that their team are no good but is less challenge due to less focus.
Juz my points of views.
[网络蚂蚁 (11-23 0:17, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]70楼

(引用 棋仙:被徐源庆杀得和都和不掉,好惨!能和就不错了,开局就输势,大列炮输好多次了,)徐源庆是啥人?[棋天大胜 (11-23 0:30, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]71楼

(引用 网络蚂蚁:May be is reason behind ! Other teams had put more focus on Boonlay ,White sand A/B and ended up 义顺南,甘邦格南 break through....)Welcome back. The score of one board could affect a lot ........e.g. if smmasing won 李勇, Bishan could move up to 3rd position.

At all times, I do not consider this one day 2 rounds (2 boards) type of team competition could really show the standard level of all teams except if you are really the first team or last team, e.g. Catholic (at another level, my separate note on this too.).

But due to budget and time, this one day team event is still the "best way" for Singapore xiangqi clubs currently ???!!!

Actually, in my separate postings, I did suggest to use a 4 boards method one-day event, i.e. you need to have 4 boards between two teams ....

http://bbs.huasing.org/wap/xbbs.php?B=123_10951092
[棋人生 (11-23 6:43, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]72楼

(引用 棋天大胜:徐源庆是啥人?)徐源庆是义顺南大将,好像是做老师的,文文静静,杀人不眨眼.[棋仙 (11-23 9:13, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]73楼

(引用 棋天大胜:徐源庆是啥人?)Welcome back. Where is your brother 齐天大圣 ? We need ....two of you to join back so that we can have more than hundred changes per person in 悟入棋途, i.e. 36 major changes and 72 minor changes. [棋人生 (11-23 10:04, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]74楼

(引用 棋人生:Welcome back. The score of one board could affect a lot ........e.g. if smmasing won 李勇, Bishan could move up to 3rd position....)Another good method is the World Cup method, i.e. to have e.g. 11 teams of ....10 players each with 5 graded and 5 non-graded to play under the individuals sydtem, after 2 or 3 rounds of 60 minutes system or 4 or 5 rounds of 30 minutes system, to sum up the scores of all 10 members under the same team, this could be a better way to rate the standard in the same competition.

For Round 1, we could have a random pairing but also to ensure graded play with non-graded and all 10 opponent players are from 10 different team. The pairing of Round 2 and after will be handled by software totally.

If due to budget problem, we could use this method for 全国选区象棋团体赛 in future. In this way, we may not have individual prizes and only the team prizes.
[棋人生 (11-23 10:41, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]75楼

(引用 棋人生:洪福阳,16岁。)2007 Internal Competition, 洪福阳(2006丙组冠军)starts from 乙组 ...[棋人生 (11-23 11:44, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]76楼

(引用 棋人生:Welcome back. Where is your brother 齐天大圣 ? We need ....two of you to join back so that we can have more than hundred changes...)36 major changes and 72 minor changes. 让我不禁联想到(图)一个同学他老婆给他准备的便当

[一刀n断 (11-23 13:46, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]77楼

(引用 棋仙:徐源庆是义顺南大将,好像是做老师的,文文静静,杀人不眨眼.)呵呵,他脾气是很好的。不象我们,他杀的是棋,对杀人没什么兴趣。

[几度 (11-23 13:54, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]78楼

(引用 网络蚂蚁:May be is reason behind ! Other teams had put more focus on Boonlay ,White sand A/B and ended up 义顺南,甘邦格南 break through....)TrueLike at Ngee Soon South, we didn't realized the namelist was posted before we rushed into the hall to submit our lineup. We didn't have time to check it and assumed Boon Lay one of the top teams as usual. Most people only noticed Boon Lay only sent 2 ranked players this time after round 1 started. Boon Lay still got the 5th position though. Boon Lay's no-rank players are also strong.

This is somehow part of the 2-round competition method. Teams who consider themselves medium to strong would try to score from other strong ones. Weaker teams thus benefit. For this time, I regret that Boon Lay was unlucky.
[几度 (11-23 14:14, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]79楼

(引用 一刀n断:36 major changes and 72 minor changes. 让我不禁联想到(图)一个同学他老婆给他准备的便当 ...)虽然和象棋没什么关系,不过是很经典。[几度 (11-23 23:14, Long long ago)] [ 传统版 | sForum ][登录后回复]80楼


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