4-page 碧山民众俱乐部象棋会简讯 (28) to be published on 15 Nov 2007 .....
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-03 22:43:25  41楼
don't players in the higher groups have a higher chance of getting top 8?don't players in the higher groups have a higher chance of getting into top 8. for example A player in group A who loses all in the first phase would go on to group E in the second phase. Even if the player loses all in the second phase he would still get top 8 if there is no lei tai or if the lei tai does not fight till the top. Whereas a player in group E who wants to fight up would have to win every round. Hence the players in the higher groups at the start would have more advantage.
key point not to miss -- the system is 分级循环赛 and not 分组循环赛 ....

for 分级循环赛 in football etc, those promoted can play in higher division only in next year but our system allow them to play in the same event, it is a plus point, the promoted players do not need to wait for one year.
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-03 22:49:05  42楼
don't players in the higher groups have a higher chance of getting top 8?don't players in the higher groups have a higher chance of getting into top 8. for example A player in group A who loses all in the first phase would go on to group E in the second phase. Even if the player loses all in the second phase he would still get top 8 if there is no lei tai or if the lei tai does not fight till the top. Whereas a player in group E who wants to fight up would have to win every round. Hence the players in the higher groups at the start would have more advantage.
Sorry, I should welcome you first, to have high ranking players 将帅in ....
this discussion, as mentioned we will review and fine tune the system details for future years, so please let us have more views if any.
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-04 06:41:00  43楼
don't players in the higher groups have a higher chance of getting top 8?don't players in the higher groups have a higher chance of getting into top 8. for example A player in group A who loses all in the first phase would go on to group E in the second phase. Even if the player loses all in the second phase he would still get top 8 if there is no lei tai or if the lei tai does not fight till the top. Whereas a player in group E who wants to fight up would have to win every round. Hence the players in the higher groups at the start would have more advantage.
The forming of 擂台could be from the top too ( 擂台主 and 攻擂)

our this year Group A had 4 players, 1 Grade 1, 2 Grade 2 and 1 no grade (2003 2nd position, 2005 8th position, 2006 not participated due to overseas) and 6 players in Group B.

after Phase 2, if one or few Group A members at the bottom of Group E, then the condition of forming 擂台 is fulfilled,i.e. all (one or few Group A members) will become 擂台主, the 1st and or the next few in Group F will qualify to 攻擂 starting with bottom of Group E as 擂台主 and ist of Group F to 攻擂 in Round 1 of Phase 3, then follow by ...... depending on the result of Round 1 of Phase 3.

An example, if 1 no grade (2003 2nd position, 2005 3rd position, 2006 not participated due to overseas) in Group E is the 6th position instead of 5th position, then he will be the 擂台主 for Group E 1st, 2nd .... to 攻擂.

Alternatively, if any group C member at the top of Group F after Phase 2, then the condition of forming 擂台 is fulfilled too, i.e. he can 攻擂 starting from Group E bottom and move upward.

For this year, starting with 4 groups, any of the 6 following conditions will fulfill the forming of 擂台 :

1 any group A at bottom of Group E 擂台主(two cases happened in 2006)
2 any group B at top of Group E 攻擂
3 any group B at bottom of Group F 擂台主 (one case happened this year)
4 any group C at top of Group F 攻擂(one case happened in 2006)
5 any group C at bottom of Group G 擂台主
6 any group D at top of Group G 攻擂(one case happened this year)

For 2006 starting with 3 groups (no Grade D), 3 cases qualified for 擂台主 or 攻擂 conditions, in 2007, 2 cases qualified for 擂台主 or 攻擂 conditions.


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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-04 06:46:51  44楼
The forming of 擂台could be from the top too ( 擂台主 and 攻擂) our this year Group A had 4 players, 1 Grade 1, 2 Grade 2 and 1 no grade (2003 2nd position, 2005 8th position, 2006 not participated due to overseas) and 6 players in Group B. after Phase 2, if one or few Group A members at the bottom of Group E, then the condition of forming 擂台 is fulfilled,i.e. all (one or few Group A members) will become 擂台主, the 1st and or the next few in Group F will qualify to 攻擂 starting with bottom of Group E as 擂台主 and ist of Group F to 攻擂 in Round 1 of Phase 3, then follow by ...... depending on the result of Round 1 of Phase 3. An example, if 1 no grade (2003 2nd position, 2005 3rd position, 2006 not participated due to overseas) in Group E is the 6th position instead of 5th position, then he will be the 擂台主 for Group E 1st, 2nd .... to 攻擂. Alternatively, if any group C member at the top of Group F after Phase 2, then the condition of forming 擂台 is fulfilled too, i.e. he can 攻擂 starting from (more...)
then he will be the 擂台主 for Group F 1st, 2nd .... to 攻擂.
typo error in previous posting.


the correct wordings as below :

.... then he will be the 擂台主 for Group F 1st, 2nd .... to 攻擂.
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-05 23:44:42  45楼
还是发文本好了此盘是内部比赛第3轮,我执黑与洪帮主的一盘棋,感觉我已经反先,无奈还是没有胜出,末局觉得红有机会胜出,可惜洪帮主没有下出。 1. 炮八平五 马8进7 2. 马八进七 车1进1 3. 车九平八 马2进1 4. 士四进五 车1平6 5. 马二进一 卒1进1 6. 车八进四 车6进3 7. 炮二平四 马1进2 8. 车八平二 马2进3 9. 炮五平六 车9平8 10. 兵一进一 炮2平3 11. 相三进五 炮8退1 12. 炮六进六 卒9进1 13. 马一退三 炮8平6 14. 车二进五 马7退8 15. 炮四平三 卒9进1 16. 车一进四 马8进9 17. 车一平六 马9进8 18. 炮三进四 马3进5 19. 马三进五 炮3进5 20. 炮三平七 炮3退3 21. 炮六退三 马8进6 22. 炮六平九 炮3进3 23. 炮九进四 士6进5 24. 车六平七 马6进5 25. 相七进五 炮3退4 26. 车七进二 车6平1 27. 炮九退三 车1进2 28. 炮九平五 象3进5 29. 炮五平二 车1平5 30. 炮二进三 炮6退1
Thanks for the records, I need to learn from you to keep proper records ....
in future.

Yes, a draw is good enough for me, at

24. 车六平七

at least I can have a draw lah .....

Good to hear from 几度 and others, thanks.
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-06 06:54:05  46楼
分级循环赛曁棋艺水平单一分级制 is a good system ......after we used the system in 2006 (24 players in 3 groups) and 2007 (20 players in 4 groups), we will review and fine tune the system details for future years. So far, we could notice that instead of round robin system for all players (23 or 19 rounds), our players just need to play with those players having about the same level (11 or 8 rounds), Phase 3 擂台赛 will take care of players with too high or too low grouping before the competition started. Furthermore, a 100% participation rate for 20 players over 3 days in this year implies that weekend is still a better period for internal competition as compared to more than 10 wednesdays each in the last three internal competitions although weekday could have more players registered initially.
The 2007 Internal Competition Ranking before Phase 3 .....
The Bishan EXCO last night discussed and agreed that after Phase 3, the 20 players will be divided under 4 levels (as in 2006) of 5 players each for the use by future internal compettions if needed, The ranking before Phase 3 as below :

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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-08 11:21:48  47楼
The 2007 Internal Competition Ranking before Phase 3 .....The Bishan EXCO last night discussed and agreed that after Phase 3, the 20 players will be divided under 4 levels (as in 2006) of 5 players each for the use by future internal compettions if needed, The ranking before Phase 3 as below : (more...)
only one Bishan Mind Sport Team ......(Registration wil be closed on 10 Dec)

from the Mind Sport Team event rules, team could be formed with all masters and grade 1s, the team standard could be as good as Lion City Cup Group A, i.e. better than Lee Bee Wah's Cup.

We have decided to send only one team as quite a few players are not free during the Dec holidays.

5 of the top 8 players of 2007 internal competition will join the team, in addition, we will include a few more players from those members who are not free to join the internal competition.

Hope we have better performance than as in Lee Bee Wah's Cup.
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-09 11:22:54  48楼
only one Bishan Mind Sport Team ......(Registration wil be closed on 10 Dec) from the Mind Sport Team event rules, team could be formed with all masters and grade 1s, the team standard could be as good as Lion City Cup Group A, i.e. better than Lee Bee Wah's Cup. We have decided to send only one team as quite a few players are not free during the Dec holidays. 5 of the top 8 players of 2007 internal competition will join the team, in addition, we will include a few more players from those members who are not free to join the internal competition. Hope we have better performance than as in Lee Bee Wah's Cup.
The team composition .....

We have maximum of 1 Grade 1 and 3 Grade 2s, others without grades, hope that our team can be in the Top 16 ....
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-11 07:50:56  49楼
评几天没有上来了,刚刚才看到你的对局。我今天头脑不大灵光,如果说错了请多多包涵。有些步可能有临场关系的影响,如果你自己说会更清楚一些。 ---------------------------------------------------- 1. 炮八平五 马8进7 2. 马八进七 车1进1 3. 车九平八 马2进1 4. 士四进五 ………… 黑方精研单提马,每逢重要比赛往往采用,因此对手容易准备布局。红方补仕,大概是想避开谱着,但毕竟容易失先。同样补仕,似乎仕六进五,避免给对方控制帅门以及将来3路炮暗瞄底相,会稍好一些。 4. ………… 车1平6 5. 马二进一 ………… 仍可马二进三,以后有炮五平六、相三进五的调整,右翼较活。 5. ………… 卒1进1 因为红方慢了一步出子,巡河车带出边马是当然的反击。另外也有车6进4的考虑。 6. 车八进四 ………… 巡河车容易被利用。多走车八进六。 6. ………… 车6进3 7. 炮二平四 ………… 如兵一进一,马1进2,马一进二,车6平4,黑方得子,红方的反击不成立。这就是补仕慢了一步的结果。 7. ………… 马1进2 可以车9平8等一手,红兵一进一,炮8平9,红方没有什么好棋走(车一平二、车八平二或炮四退二,都要损步),黑反先。 车9 (more...)
Thanks for the review, and .......

this is to answer 卷心菜's questions 0 bytes 2007-11-29 18:20

http://bbs.huasing.org/sForum/bbs.php?B=123_10971380
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-11 13:04:58  50楼
分级循环赛曁棋艺水平单一分级制 is a good system ......after we used the system in 2006 (24 players in 3 groups) and 2007 (20 players in 4 groups), we will review and fine tune the system details for future years. So far, we could notice that instead of round robin system for all players (23 or 19 rounds), our players just need to play with those players having about the same level (11 or 8 rounds), Phase 3 擂台赛 will take care of players with too high or too low grouping before the competition started. Furthermore, a 100% participation rate for 20 players over 3 days in this year implies that weekend is still a better period for internal competition as compared to more than 10 wednesdays each in the last three internal competitions although weekday could have more players registered initially.
Minimum Number of Rounds in Future Years .....

from the review of method used in 2006 and 2007 for 分级循环赛曁棋艺水平单一分级制, we may consider to introduce minimum number of rounds for all players due to :

2006 -- 8 players played up to 7 rounds in Phase 1 only, i.e. they did not need to play in Phase 2 (4 more rounds).

2007 -- 2 players played 3 rounds in Phase 1 only, i.e. they did not need to play in Phase 2 (3 more rounds).

With the above, we may consider to have the minimum number of rounds is 5 or

mimimum number of rounds > 50% of maximum number of rounds.

Using the figures from 2006 and 2007, the minimum number of rounds are :

2006 -- 6 (maximum was 11 for Phases 1 & 2)

2007 -- 5 (maximum was 8 for Phases 1 & 2)

The proposal is for the considerations by planners of future internal competitions.



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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-15 22:57:22  51楼
The 2007 Internal Competition Ranking before Phase 3 .....The Bishan EXCO last night discussed and agreed that after Phase 3, the 20 players will be divided under 4 levels (as in 2006) of 5 players each for the use by future internal compettions if needed, The ranking before Phase 3 as below : (more...)
Study of Anchorvale CC Fast Game and Bishan Internal Competition ..

from the records, Bishan has 7 members participated in Anchorvale CC Fast Game but none of them in the Top 15 .....


Ranking in Ranking in Bishan
Anchorvale CC Fast Game Internal Competition

17 not free to join internal competition

22 10

23 (10 yrs old) 14 (攻擂 on 16 Dec at 2 pm.)

26 7

29 3

32 2

34 18


should I conclude that those performed well in Bishan Internal Competition (60 minutes system) could not play 10 minutes fast game ???!!!

Yes, currently we should pay attention to 30 minutes to 60 minutes system first, 10 minutes fast game area should be considered with lower priority at the moment.
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-16 04:07:52  52楼
Study of Anchorvale CC Fast Game and Bishan Internal Competition .. from the records, Bishan has 7 members participated in Anchorvale CC Fast Game but none of them in the Top 15 ..... Ranking in Ranking in Bishan Anchorvale CC Fast Game Internal Competition 17 not free to join internal competition 22 10 23 (10 yrs old) 14 (攻擂 on 16 Dec at 2 pm.) 26 7 29 3 32 2 34 18 should I conclude that those performed well in Bishan Internal Competition (60 minutes system) could not play 10 minutes fast game ???!!! Yes, currently we should pay attention to 30 minutes to 60 minutes system first, 10 minutes fast game area should be considered with lower priority at the moment.
To align those figures .....

Ranking in ----------------Ranking in Bishan
Anchorvale CC Fast Game ---Internal Competition

17 ------------------------not free to join internal competition

22 ------------------------10

23 (10 yrs old) -----------14 (攻擂 on 16 Dec at 2 pm.)

26 -------------------------7

29 -------------------------3

32 -------------------------2

34 ------------------------18
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-16 10:55:41  53楼
分级循环赛曁棋艺水平单一分级制 is a good system ......after we used the system in 2006 (24 players in 3 groups) and 2007 (20 players in 4 groups), we will review and fine tune the system details for future years. So far, we could notice that instead of round robin system for all players (23 or 19 rounds), our players just need to play with those players having about the same level (11 or 8 rounds), Phase 3 擂台赛 will take care of players with too high or too low grouping before the competition started. Furthermore, a 100% participation rate for 20 players over 3 days in this year implies that weekend is still a better period for internal competition as compared to more than 10 wednesdays each in the last three internal competitions although weekday could have more players registered initially.
使各队从一开始就与实力接近的队伍交锋 .....
分级循环赛曁棋艺水平单一分级制 is having the same concept ......

just need to play with those players having about the same level -- key point


比赛编对方式改动的目的则是为了减少过去奥赛前两轮对手实力悬殊过大的情况。使各队从一开始就与实力接近的队伍交锋,使比赛更为激烈。


国际象棋奥赛赛制发生重大改变 由场分高低定名次
发布时间 [2007-12-12 10:38:00]
国际象棋奥赛赛制发生重大改变 由场分高低定名次

http://sports.sina.com.cn 2007年12月12日10:03 新浪体育

  新浪体育讯 前不久国际棋联在土耳其安塔利亚召开了第78次会议。会议进行了讨论了多项议题,其中之一即是讨论对国际象棋奥赛赛制进行改革。昨天国 际棋联正式宣布从2008年德国德累斯顿奥赛开始对奥赛赛制实施的一系列重大改变。具体改变如下:

  1、台次和人数改变。女子奥赛由原来的三个台次增至四个台次。每队成员由原来的四人变为五人,其中四人上场,一人替补。男子奥赛仍为四 个台次,但每队成员由原来的六人减为五人,即替补队员减少一人。这样,男女奥赛都将比赛四个台次,各支队伍都将由五名队员组成。

  2、轮次改变。比赛轮次由原来的14轮(或13轮)改为11轮。自从1976年引入瑞士制以来,国际象棋奥赛一直是14轮(有时为13轮)。

  3、比赛编对方式发生重大变化。(以120支队伍为例)首先将参赛队伍按等级分由高到低排列。

  在首轮比赛的配对时,给列表前半部分的队伍(即等级分排名前60的队伍)加上一个初始“浮动积分”。以造成如下的配对效果:首轮配对为 1-31、2-32、3-33 ... 29-59、30-60,然后是61-91, 62-92, 63-93。而不再向以前奥赛那样编对:1-61, 2-62, 3-63。

  在第二轮比赛中:(仍以120支队伍为例)

  ★队伍列表前半部分(即等级分排名前60的队伍)的首轮获胜的各队之间将进行编对,编对形势应该为1-16, 2-17...

  ★队伍列表后半部分(即等级分排名后60的队伍)的首轮输棋的各队之间将进行编对,编对形势应该为91-106, 92-107...

  ★队伍列表前半部分(即等级分排名前60的队伍)的首轮输棋的各队将与队伍列表后半部分(即等级分排名后60的队伍)首轮赢棋的队伍编对 ,编对形势应为31-61, 32-62, 33-63 ...

  在第三轮比赛编对时,将首轮中(为等级分排名前60的队伍)所加的“浮动积分”去掉,按照各队真实积分进行编对。

  4、区分名次方式改变。由以局分区分名次改为由场分区分名次。每队胜一场得2分,平一场得1分,输一场得0分。

  5、破同分规则

  △场分相同的情况下,将按照所谓的“梭尼伯恩-伯格(Sonnenborn-Berger)”分高低来区分名次。所有11个对手中取场分较高的前10个对手 ,然后计算梭尼伯恩-伯格分。

  梭尼伯恩-伯格分 = 每个对手的场分 ×本队与该对手的比赛得分。梭尼伯恩-伯格分高者名次列前。

  △如果“梭尼伯恩-伯格”分相同,则需比较所谓的“布赫兹(Buchholz)”分。

  布赫兹分 = 所有对手的场分总和 - 场分最低的对手的场分。

  △如果“布赫兹”分仍相同,则比较各队的局分。

  在这些改动中,最大的变动应该说是由局分定名次改为按场分定名次。在国际象棋界各种世界性和洲际团体赛中,奥赛是唯一以局分定名次的团体赛。以往奥赛中,各队均以多抢分为首要目的。而此次改动必将对各支队伍的排兵布阵和比赛策略产生影响。但这并不是说局分不再重要,因为在破同分的规则中,梭尼伯恩-伯格分是由场分和局分共同计算出的。当场分相同时,局分越高,梭尼伯恩-伯格分也将越有利。比赛编对方式改动的目的则是为了减少过去奥赛前两轮对手实力悬殊过大的情况。使各队从一开始就与实力接近的队伍交锋,使比赛更为激烈。(塔尔)
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2007-12-16 18:13:56  54楼
There is hope for Singapore Chess SceneTan Jing Ling is a promising young lad. Is he the one that you are referring to, 棋人生? The 10 years old that is currently representing Pasir Ris East CC? He told me that he is being coached by Xiong Guo Wei. Anyway, in round 2 of the Anchorvale CC Fast Chess Competition, I was up against him (at least I think it is him). In that game, I gave a blind piece and was losing, only to be saved by the clock. According to the rules in this competition, even after the flag for the player with an overwhelming advantage in position has dropped, the arbitor can still overrule the defeat to become a draw (?!). Though I would like to comfirm this ruling again, I was happy to see that there are a lot of up and coming youth players in the chess scenes. It was a good game nonetheless.
Yes, we spoke at SIXGA this afternoon ......

陈靖麟 (攻擂) lost to 吴荣华 (擂台主), this is the end of Bishan 2007 Internal Competition, the ranking list is confirmed as below :

http://bbs.huasing.org/sForum/bbs.php?B=123_10973238
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作者:棋人生 (等级:7 - 出类拔萃,发帖:2167) 发表:2008-01-24 00:48:30  55楼
Minimum Number of Rounds in Future Years ..... from the review of method used in 2006 and 2007 for 分级循环赛曁棋艺水平单一分级制, we may consider to introduce minimum number of rounds for all players due to : 2006 -- 8 players played up to 7 rounds in Phase 1 only, i.e. they did not need to play in Phase 2 (4 more rounds). 2007 -- 2 players played 3 rounds in Phase 1 only, i.e. they did not need to play in Phase 2 (3 more rounds). With the above, we may consider to have the minimum number of rounds is 5 or mimimum number of rounds > 50% of maximum number of rounds. Using the figures from 2006 and 2007, the minimum number of rounds are : 2006 -- 6 (maximum was 11 for Phases 1 & 2) 2007 -- 5 (maximum was 8 for Phases 1 & 2) The proposal is for the considerations by planners of future internal competitions.
Bishan EXCO meeting has decided that there is no need to have this ...
additional condition (Minimum Number of Rounds) as the existing system (分级循环赛曁棋艺水平单一分级制 is a good and workable system) used in 2007 Internal Competition is working well.

Anyway, the organiser for 2008 Internal Competition may wish to improve the existing system if possible.
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